The Constant Change of Perspectives: A Q&A with Corey Tabor

I dunno, folks. I’ll be frank. I think we have a problem here. Do you ever get a feeling that certain geniuses aren’t appreciated during their own time? I have this fear when it comes to Corey Tabor. By his own admission, the man is not one of those slambang, in-your-face, caustic self-promoters selling himself to the masses. He has no TikTok channel. I don’t turn on the Jimmel Kimmel Show and see him sitting in a seat there. Instead, the man slowly, methodically, carefully, and with great love, churns out some of the smartest books for kids today. I say with complete honesty that if you have not read his easy book series starring Fox (and winner of many a fine Geisel Award) then you are missing out. Similarly, his picture books are exceedingly well crafted. So much so that when I was offered the chance to promote his books, I went the extra yard and asked if I could interview him instead. It’s not that I don’t want to also review his books someday. I just wanted to get a sense of how the man ticks. And now, after today, you’ll know too.

But before we get into all of that, have you met Ursula? Not the stone cold Disney villain, but rather a sweet little upside-down catfish. Here’s how the publisher describes the book Ursula Upside Down (out now):

“Ursula finds confidence in seeing the world her own way in another innovative, flipped-format picture book from Caldecott Honoree and Geisel Award winner Corey R. Tabor. 

Ursula is a happy catfish, swimming through a shimmering river with weeds waving above and a sky full of scrumptious bugs below. 

Then one question turns her world upside down. 

Is left right? Is right wrong? Which way even is up? 

Children will love turning the book upside down and back again as they follow Ursula’s humorous journey to self-discovery.”

Betsy Bird: Corey! Thank you so much for offering me the chance to ask you some questions about URSULA UPSIDE DOWN! Cute book, cute concept, cute design layout. Let’s begin and the beginning then: Where did you get this idea?

Corey Tabor: Thanks for having me! (Longtime reader, first time interviewee.) When I was a kid I loved looking at the world upside down—from a swing, from my bed, while lying on the grass in a park. I was remembering that and got to thinking about how fun it would be to make a book where the whole world is upside down (from the reader’s perspective), but the character is right side up. The first version of the story was about an upside-down duck and was about as nonsensical as it sounds. Why was the duck upside down? I didn’t know. So I put that idea away for awhile—a couple of years—until I learned about upside-down catfish. I don’t remember where I first came across these fascinating fish. (My son reads a lot of nonfiction picture books so it might have come from him.) But once I had Ursula, the story came together pretty quickly.

BB: Yeah, I learn about the most interesting animals through kids’ nonfiction to. And starting with MEL FELL and continuing on through with SIMON AND THE BETTER BONE you’ve been playing with the format of the picture books you create. Most interestingly, it’s never a gimmick, but integral to the plot. URSULA follows in much the same way. Were there any particular influences you had in mind when you began making books with original layouts like these?

Corey: I’m a big fan of Suzy Lee’s picture books and it was probably her book SHADOW that first got me thinking about playing with the picture book format. Another influence was Jon Agee’s THE WALL IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BOOK. Both are great examples of books that play with the format in a way that’s integral to the story.

I must have had those books in the back of my mind when I got the idea for MEL FELL. I was at a lake looking up at a tall tree and had the idea for a picture book where you follow a character up and down the tree, seeing all the animals who live there. The idea of turning the book on its side, letting you flip up and down the tree, fit perfectly with the vertical nature of the story.

With URSULA UPSIDE DOWN, having the reader literally flip the book when Ursula’s world flips upside down seemed like the perfect way to let the reader really feel the change in perspective.

BB: Suzy Lee! That makes so much sense! Part of what I love about your books so much is that their format acknowledges that these books are meant to be read aloud and played with. A person reading to a large group of children is going to blow the minds of their audience when they turn Ursula’s story upside down and then just keep reading. Do you ever test these books with kids in the process of making them? Or do you just test with yourself, to make sure they work correctly?

Corey: I mostly test them by myself (presenting/public speaking is not my cup of tea), but I’ll also read them with my wife and my son (who is five, and has great taste in picture books). And I often run my ideas by my wonderful critique group.

For my other books—the ones that open and read like normal books—I’ll usually make a digital dummy when I’m working on the story and the sketches. But for these twisty ones I always print them out and put together a physical dummy that I can play with, and try to wrap my head around. It’s impossible to test this stuff digitally. And as someone who loves the physicality of books, I like the idea of making books that only really work (or at least work best) as physical books.

BB: In the case of MEL and URSULA you take an animal in the natural world and use their special skills to make a story. Where do you find these animals? Do you keep a little roster of them on the Notes app of your phone for future reference? Or do they just sort of come to you one-by-one?

Corey: I do have a ridiculous number of ideas in my Notes app, and a bunch of them are about animals I’d like to make books about. As I mentioned, my son loves nonfiction and is always telling me about interesting animals, and sometimes I’ll come across an animal while I’m just out for a walk (SNAIL CROSSING started that way). One animal currently in the roster is the mimic octopus, but how to make a picture book that changes color and shape…?

BB: Oo. I love that. Along the same lines, have you ever had an idea for a book that seemed like a good idea but you just couldn’t quite get it to gel for some reason?

Corey: So many! I have a whole digital drawer full of stories that I haven’t quite figured out (yet!). Sometimes if I’m lucky, an old idea comes back in a new form. For instance, SIMON AND THE BETTER BONE began as a book about a swallow playing with its reflection in a lake. The story didn’t work until years later when I decided to turn the bird into the dog from Aesop’s fable.

BB: Finally, what’s next for you? What else do you have coming out these days?

Corey: My latest early reader, FOX VERSUS FOX, just came out in March, and I have another one coming out in October called FOX PLAYS BALL, which is more Calvinball than football. I’ve also been working on a collaborative picture book with my friends Ben Clanton and Andy Musser called PAPILIO. It’s about the life of a butterfly and each of us wrote and illustrated the story of one of the stages (I did the chrysalis). That one’s taking flight in summer 2025.

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Could you ask for anything more? I’m just so delighted that I finally had this chance to talk to Corey (after a fashion). Many thanks to Abby Dommert and the folks at Harper Collins Children’s Books for helping to put all of this together. Ursula Upside Down is on shelves everywhere, so get it now if you can.

Filed under: Interviews