Out There, Waiting for Me: A Q&A with Jennifer L. Holm About OUTSIDE

Jenni Holm’s on a bit of a fascinating tear these days, wouldn’t you say? Now here we have a career worth examining with interest. She wins herself multiple Newbery Honors then shifts gears and starts doing graphic novels with her brother. Babymouse, Sunny, that sort of thing. Then she sort of doubles back and does novels again, only this time they’ve a distinctly science fiction bent. Your cloning issues in The Thirteenth Goldfish or living in outer space in The Lion of Mars. Little wonder that when I heard about her latest book, Outside (out October 7th), I wanted to talk to her myself.

One of the more interesting aspects of Outside is its size. You know how movies in theaters have slowly bloated over the years into 3+ hour long diversions? My husband likes to call shorter movies “handsome”. Well, in much the same way, many novels for kids have grown and bloated over the years as well. As such, when you encounter a book like Jenni’s with its generous font size and slim packaging, it feels distinctly “handsome” as well.

The book is best described by its publisher in this way:

Whatever you do, don’t leave home.

Razzi has always been told: Don’t go Outside. It isn’t safe. There are people and creatures out there that will harm you. The walls of the Refuge will protect you from them.

Razzi’s friend Ollie was curious about Outside… and it led to his death. So Razzi is trying to be on her best behavior. She is the oldest kid left, the one the younger kids look up to. She has to follow the rules.

But Outside has a way of getting in, and Razzi, guided by a dog she has a strangely close connection with, wonders what it’s like to run free beyond the walls.

Questions? I had them:

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Betsy Bird: Jenni! What a delight to talk to you. Let’s discuss OUTSIDE! I’m happy to say that I finished it just in time to talk to you and, oh boy, am I glad that I did. That’s a twisty, turny little book right there. This will be a bit of a tricky talk since I don’t want to spoil any secrets for people who haven’t read it yet. Let’s just start at the beginning: Where did the idea of this book come from for you?

Jennifer Holm: At its heart, this book is a meditation about the differences between my daughter and I. When I was growing up, I was like Razzi—a responsible older kid who didn’t question authority. I never challenged the grown-ups in my life. I just figured they knew what the facts were. (After all, they were the grown-ups.)

But my daughter Millie is the opposite of me, and she was the inspiration for Ollie, the curious artistic child who just wants to see the Outside. For one, Millie never stops asking questions, especially when it comes to adults. She doesn’t take anything at face value. You know that great parent retort “Because I said so”? That does not work on her.

So, writing Outside helped me to understand both perspectives.

BB: While I know that I’m a 47-year-old woman reading books for kids, I can’t tell you just how smart and clever I felt when I found myself thinking as I read, “This story kind of has a Boxcar Children feel to it” and then lo and behold the characters start reading Boxcar Children in the story! I tried to pin down what it was that felt that way to me. From your perspective, what was the influence of that book on your own?

Jenni: I am a huge Boxcar Children fan. My first-grade teacher read the book to us. It’s one of my fondest memories. So, it’s part of my creative DNA for sure and it must have seeped a little into the story.

BB: As I read through this book, I realized that it was a rarity: A legitimately short middle grade novel for kids! It has a larger font, the story is quick and to the point, and it isn’t a brick of a book. It honestly reminded me of those old Apple paperbacks I used to get from the Scholastic Book Fair, back in the day. Was that intentional on your part, making it so accessible to readers?

Jenni: I am very committed to writing shorter books for children. In my experience, kids these days are easily discouraged. This lack of confidence is the death-knell to creating a lifelong reader. However, when a child sails through a shorter chapter book, they feel a sense of accomplishment and that will encourage them to continue reading. Hopefully, they will be picking up chunky books in a few years!

BB: Interestingly, I keep pairing this book in my head with Rebecca Stead’s THE EXPERIMENT (also out this year). In both cases you have kids having to make discoveries about their world and selves that are at odds with the authority figures in their lives. In an era where the people in charge of our country raise concerns of their own, was any of that on your mind as you wrote the book?

Jenni: I love THE EXPERIMENT! But my inspiration was the idea that adults sometimes fudge the truth to protect children. This stems from an incident in my own childhood.

So, I have a much older brother named Keith and he joined the Navy when I was really young, like five or six years old. I didn’t understand why my brother just disappeared one day. Where had he gone? Where was “The Navy?” It all seemed vague and mysterious. I was very upset and worried.

I asked my dad incessantly about where Keith was living. There was a corporate park near my dad’s office. One day he pointed to this imposing building and said, “That’s where Keith is living now – that’s the Navy. He’s doing just fine. You don’t need to worry anymore.”

And I felt better. (BTW, it was an IBM building.) So, for a few years there, I literally thought my big brother was living in the IBM building, lol.

BB: Dogs play a major role in the book. Dog thoughts. Dog feelings. Connections to dogs (in this case, literally). I know you’ve owned cats, but are you a dog person as well in any way?

Jenni: While I had dogs growing up, I am squarely a cat person these days. But I had the great fortune to meet an amazing dog who became the inspiration for Wind the greyhound.

This dog was so smart and intuitive that you almost forgot she was an animal. She was more like a dog with a human soul. This clever, blue-eyed dog was named Poppy and she tragically died in a car accident at a young age. I have lost beloved pets of my own, but it was honestly shocking to witness the grief that Poppy’s humans suffered after her death. It was on par with losing a child.

BB: Folks can debate if this book is science fiction or not (and with your recent books The Lion of Mars and The Fourteenth Goldfish you’ve been on an intriguing sci-fi tear) but your inclusion of xenotransplantation (a big theme in Mary Roach’s latest book) of a greyhound heart into a human child’s body is squarely futuristic. Where did you get the idea for that inclusion in your story?

Jenni: It’s funny because sometimes you get ideas, and you don’t even know where they came from. But then you look back and you’re like—AHA!

I recently figured out why I was fixated on Razzi having a heart transplant. A year or two before I began writing this book, a dear friend of mine had to have lifesaving experimental heart surgery. She was very healthy, so it was a shock. Looking back, I think that’s what got me thinking about transplanting animal organs into humans. I did kind of fall down the medical rabbit hole investigating what is possible (it’s becoming more realistic by the day) and I started to really contemplate the ethics of using animal organs in humans.

BB: Finally, what else are you working on these days? What’s on the horizon?

Jenni: Sunny is hitting the road! My bro Matt and I are so excited to be creating a summer camper van vacation book. 1970s Winnebago here we come! So keep an eye out for Sunny Hits The Road!

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Big time thanks to Jenni for taking the time to answer my questions and to Victoria Velez and the team at Scholastic for helping to put this all together. Outside is out October 7th so be sure to look for it soon!

Filed under: Interviews